I'm going to be gradually adding support for more assets as I have time. Probably going to start adding the next couple in the next week.
Main thing that will cause problems if the assets color variations weren't prepped yet, which may delay some assets until I can clean them up. I should be able to do hair assets and my already cleaned up clothing assets pretty easily, though, which is what I'll be focusing on next.
Yeah I know, but I still don't like reopening old threads. I just wasn't paying close attention. But if I do come up with something I'll definitely post it onto OGA and mention this thread.
I was literally just thinking about doing something like this... this could be fun. I was recently playing through ZALIA (basically an upgraded PC remake/version of Zelda II) and I was thinking it could be fun to create my own sprites that mimic the style... Obviously I'd make them from scratch, of course.
I have noticed recently I've been getting notified every time new tracks are added on Gumroad. I don't recall seeing this before. Makes it convenient to know exactly where to look to get the latest OGG's.
Yeah I don't like the format for the "special attack" being "run" either. It doesn't make any logical sense. Run should be a separate action. If you REALLY want consistency, what you should do is set run as a separate action, and for other assets you use, simply insert the walk animation for a missing run animation. Alternatively, if you keep them in separate files as BenCreating suggests, you can just check if a run file exists, and if it doesn't, only use walk.
I didn't catch it, but yeah, the walk animation is actually only 4 frames, not 5. Its 1 stand frame and 4 walk frames. 4 frames is actually pretty standard from what I have seen, I think classic RPG Maker uses 4 walk frames as well.
If anything, I think "howling" makes more sense as a "special attack". But that's up to you. I could see a magic wolf enemy use a howl for a spellcast of sorts (or for a special action; wolves in RPG's often use howling for a support buff), otherwise it could just be a taunt.
Yeah that's basically my thought. And there's no realistic solution to that problem. Because there's no way to make a "base" you can build off of, you need to create a lot more stuff from scratch to create a variety of unique enemies.
Sure, you can create new Wolf variations, but its hard to make something brand new out of that. Maybe something like a Cerberus or Hellhound could be a wolf variant, though. So there are ways to make some potential varieties from existing assets, but you can't make a slime from a wolf. Or a proper minotaur. (Best bet for a Minotaur right now is using the Minotaur head on character sprites.)
Using character sprites for Goblins and Orcs helps to reduce the requirements a bit, but then they're a lot smaller than a common "enemy" sprite you might see in other games. Creating a larger one effectively requires you to, again, redraw it from scratch.
And that's not even delving into big ones like dragons or other such things.
Not really necessary for the most part, but it could be a simple bob.
- Taking Damage
Hard to say. Taking damage might be useful, but it can be reflected with a red overlay or something like that as well. We don't necessarily need a "I took a hit" animation.
- Death/defeat
Similarly, not really necessary for enemies. Typically enemies just "fade away" when being defeated. This is not necessary and completedly optional.
- Basic Attack
- Spellcasting Special Attack
At least Basic Attack is obvious. A special attack isn't really all that necessary.
- Optional Auxiliry Action (just a slot for an additional attack or atypical feature. many monsters won't use this slot but it's available if needed)
I'd argue this would be the "Special Attack". Not sure what else would fit this category.
4-directional attacks would be nice, but isn't necessary.
I think overall, people just haven't been as interested in making enemies. Personally its the same for me. I haven't even theorized much on how much non-human enemies I would want anyway, but it is something I need to explore more.
Its kinda hard to set a standard with an open format. The best thing to do is to probably commission a few extra things. See if anyone is interested in taking commissions for LPC style enemies and making them larger.
There is no clear information on this at this time. Like I said above, I still subscribe to the belief that this is pattern-recognition algorithm, not derivative assets. Once the courts settle this matter, that is presumably what OGA will follow, whether its pro-AI art or against.
In terms of simple things like rotations, though, that's pretty clear. If its your work and your alterring it, well, there's no real problem there. Using AI to "enhance" an image by making it larger is probably pretty safe. Same with rotations. Rotations I have noticed can be really tricky with programs like aseprite. For me this is one of my biggest issues; rotating an asset to get a different angle of a sword, for example, and keep the same aesthetic, is quite annoying. Same thing goes for trying to get animations out, like having hair flowing behind a character. This is really tricky to deal with properly so I have been hesitant to push into this.
I have dabbled in AI a bit, but I am hesitant to use it for spriting yet at this time. Mostly I use it for references and concept art.
"And, even if it is, does it offend your sensibilities as an artist."
For most artists this is always going to be "no". It is artists who are primarily concerned about this, after all.
However, the line must be drawn somewhere. If you are concerned with offending artists, then you should never, ever, ever use AI art. There's literally nothing you can do that won't offend artists by using AI art at this point in time. If AI art becomes more acceptable in the future, such tensions will likely lessen, but many will still find offense that AI art is used in any way. Frankly, though, this is not the best question to be asking.
The biggest problem with this debate in general is honestly pretty simple--a lot of artists want to make money off of their art. The problem, however, is that art just isn't very profitable. It never has been, and its only gotten worse over time. And its not because of AI generation--its because there's too many artists out there flooding the market. The best artists will still be able to make good money, but lower-end artists are going to constantly find themselves competing with one another. AI art is not good enough to replace good artists, but it can replace "bad" art, which is the main thing it does. Otherwise, AI is primarily a tool than can enhance art-related projects.
Keep in mind, there's puritan artists out there who hate anything to do with digital art. I believe that used to be a big debate as well in the past--digital art isn't "authentic" art. Those comments aren't common anymore, but they used to be.
I'm going to be gradually adding support for more assets as I have time. Probably going to start adding the next couple in the next week.
Main thing that will cause problems if the assets color variations weren't prepped yet, which may delay some assets until I can clean them up. I should be able to do hair assets and my already cleaned up clothing assets pretty easily, though, which is what I'll be focusing on next.
Yeah I know, but I still don't like reopening old threads. I just wasn't paying close attention. But if I do come up with something I'll definitely post it onto OGA and mention this thread.
My bad, I misinterpreted the context. I saw this shared in the discord and misread what the post was saying lmao.
I was literally just thinking about doing something like this... this could be fun. I was recently playing through ZALIA (basically an upgraded PC remake/version of Zelda II) and I was thinking it could be fun to create my own sprites that mimic the style... Obviously I'd make them from scratch, of course.
I have noticed recently I've been getting notified every time new tracks are added on Gumroad. I don't recall seeing this before. Makes it convenient to know exactly where to look to get the latest OGG's.
Yeah I don't like the format for the "special attack" being "run" either. It doesn't make any logical sense. Run should be a separate action. If you REALLY want consistency, what you should do is set run as a separate action, and for other assets you use, simply insert the walk animation for a missing run animation. Alternatively, if you keep them in separate files as BenCreating suggests, you can just check if a run file exists, and if it doesn't, only use walk.
I didn't catch it, but yeah, the walk animation is actually only 4 frames, not 5. Its 1 stand frame and 4 walk frames. 4 frames is actually pretty standard from what I have seen, I think classic RPG Maker uses 4 walk frames as well.
If anything, I think "howling" makes more sense as a "special attack". But that's up to you. I could see a magic wolf enemy use a howl for a spellcast of sorts (or for a special action; wolves in RPG's often use howling for a support buff), otherwise it could just be a taunt.
Yeah that's basically my thought. And there's no realistic solution to that problem. Because there's no way to make a "base" you can build off of, you need to create a lot more stuff from scratch to create a variety of unique enemies.
Sure, you can create new Wolf variations, but its hard to make something brand new out of that. Maybe something like a Cerberus or Hellhound could be a wolf variant, though. So there are ways to make some potential varieties from existing assets, but you can't make a slime from a wolf. Or a proper minotaur. (Best bet for a Minotaur right now is using the Minotaur head on character sprites.)
Using character sprites for Goblins and Orcs helps to reduce the requirements a bit, but then they're a lot smaller than a common "enemy" sprite you might see in other games. Creating a larger one effectively requires you to, again, redraw it from scratch.
And that's not even delving into big ones like dragons or other such things.
Bookmarking. Could be neat to add in support for the new animation frames as well.
In terms of Animations:
- Moving
Obviously this is pretty standard.
- Idle
Not really necessary for the most part, but it could be a simple bob.
- Taking Damage
Hard to say. Taking damage might be useful, but it can be reflected with a red overlay or something like that as well. We don't necessarily need a "I took a hit" animation.
- Death/defeat
Similarly, not really necessary for enemies. Typically enemies just "fade away" when being defeated. This is not necessary and completedly optional.
- Basic Attack
- Spellcasting Special Attack
At least Basic Attack is obvious. A special attack isn't really all that necessary.
- Optional Auxiliry Action (just a slot for an additional attack or atypical feature. many monsters won't use this slot but it's available if needed)
I'd argue this would be the "Special Attack". Not sure what else would fit this category.
4-directional attacks would be nice, but isn't necessary.
I think overall, people just haven't been as interested in making enemies. Personally its the same for me. I haven't even theorized much on how much non-human enemies I would want anyway, but it is something I need to explore more.
Its kinda hard to set a standard with an open format. The best thing to do is to probably commission a few extra things. See if anyone is interested in taking commissions for LPC style enemies and making them larger.
"Is this fair and lawful?"
There is no clear information on this at this time. Like I said above, I still subscribe to the belief that this is pattern-recognition algorithm, not derivative assets. Once the courts settle this matter, that is presumably what OGA will follow, whether its pro-AI art or against.
In terms of simple things like rotations, though, that's pretty clear. If its your work and your alterring it, well, there's no real problem there. Using AI to "enhance" an image by making it larger is probably pretty safe. Same with rotations. Rotations I have noticed can be really tricky with programs like aseprite. For me this is one of my biggest issues; rotating an asset to get a different angle of a sword, for example, and keep the same aesthetic, is quite annoying. Same thing goes for trying to get animations out, like having hair flowing behind a character. This is really tricky to deal with properly so I have been hesitant to push into this.
I have dabbled in AI a bit, but I am hesitant to use it for spriting yet at this time. Mostly I use it for references and concept art.
"And, even if it is, does it offend your sensibilities as an artist."
For most artists this is always going to be "no". It is artists who are primarily concerned about this, after all.
However, the line must be drawn somewhere. If you are concerned with offending artists, then you should never, ever, ever use AI art. There's literally nothing you can do that won't offend artists by using AI art at this point in time. If AI art becomes more acceptable in the future, such tensions will likely lessen, but many will still find offense that AI art is used in any way. Frankly, though, this is not the best question to be asking.
The biggest problem with this debate in general is honestly pretty simple--a lot of artists want to make money off of their art. The problem, however, is that art just isn't very profitable. It never has been, and its only gotten worse over time. And its not because of AI generation--its because there's too many artists out there flooding the market. The best artists will still be able to make good money, but lower-end artists are going to constantly find themselves competing with one another. AI art is not good enough to replace good artists, but it can replace "bad" art, which is the main thing it does. Otherwise, AI is primarily a tool than can enhance art-related projects.
Keep in mind, there's puritan artists out there who hate anything to do with digital art. I believe that used to be a big debate as well in the past--digital art isn't "authentic" art. Those comments aren't common anymore, but they used to be.
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